Zentner's Daughter Interview Part Two

[00:00:00, Begin Part 2]

BZ: So, I guess back to how my background started really has to do with the background of my father and his father.

So I guess after dad was so involved, I'm trying to think, what was he-his involvement in life was more to do with the public. Loved the public. So I have to say that being the oldest son his job was to help take care of the family. And there were three other brothers and a sister-two sisters.

Okay, my voice is getting crazy.

So, um. I guess, in those days, it was pretty common that he did pretty much of whatever a young lad would do. He joined the military. He was what he called the stick horse cavalry. If he was born in 1899, he was eighteen-seventeen or eighteen years old at this time. So we're looking at 1917.

He ended up in San Antone [San Antonio, Texas], and of all things, my dad was a cook.

So his background stayed pretty much the same through the cavalry, the stick horse cavalry. And after he got out of the cavalry he started off pretty much with his entrepreneurship of what he's gonna do for the rest of his life.

And for my father, it was what all was he gonna do for the rest of his life because pretty much I have to say, he always thought the grass was greener on the other side of the pasture.

He'd start a business, do something, and decide okay, I can do better than that, sell that business and go to another one. And I can attest to that because in my eighteen years of being at home we probably moved twenty-five times.So [Laughs].

I think we could have been nomads. He opened restaurants in Lowake, Rowena, Midkiff, which was how do you call Connor [Hadacol Corner was the previous name of Midkiff], San Angelo [Texas]. Then he decided that the restaurant business wasn't exactly for him. He went into the farm business, but then decided he's going back to Rowena to open another restaurant. Then he went to San Angelo. Opened another restaurant on Avenue K.

Helped his brothers open a business in Buffalo Gap, Texas, and opened a business in Del Rio, Texas. These businesses-when I say open a business, they're all restaurants, steakhouses, or as he called it, cafes.

So, in this time of growing up, in and out of different schools, the last thing I think in the world that was ever on my mind was to be in the restaurant business if it meant moving as much as my father.

So, the-my idea was to have a good education and make something of myself, because as my father would say, you're not gonna-you're a woman, first of all. It's a man's world, and you're not gonna make it in a man's world, being a woman in the restaurant business.

The more he would say that to me, the more the challenge was in the back of my mind, and um, I wanted to just dare him to say it one more time.

I got to thinking that everything that I know in life has to do with the restaurant, and maybe, maybe, this idea of the last thing I want to do is travel around-that's not what I wanted to do. But I still thought I wanted something to do with the restaurant and to prove that I could make it in the restaurant.

So I-I say it's my fairytale story, because I felt that the challenge was there, I just had to accept it. I worked a lot after school in my father's restaurants. I pretty much felt I knew everything there was to know about it.

I watched my father butcher. I watched him draw beer. I watched my mother wait on tables. So there wasn't anything I don't think I didn't learn from my parents and that I was beginning to be pretty confident that I couldn't do.

I was going to college at San Angelo State and the opportunity had come to um, further my career.

I still had in the back of my mind that I loved the public and this is gonna be something that I really think I'm gonna head in the right direction.

So I talked to my dad. Told him my plans. Big mistake. Wrong [Laughs]!

Anyway, he was not that apt with me heading in that direction and he wasn't ready to help finance me in that direction. So it was learn as much as you can about the business. Stay in the cafe. Watch what he does. And, oh my gosh, I hate to say but I was thinking I'll spend the rest of my life waiting on tables in my dad's restaurant.

And I have to say pretty much, can you, just a second. I didn't get what-

[Interruption by staff]

BZ: So I'm looking at spending the rest of my life with my family, my husband, my two children, and working at this little cafe in Rowena, Texas, at whatever the beck and call of the restaurant required.

At that time I wasn't going anywhere fast and I'm, when I do something I want it done right away. Now [Laughs].

So, uh, after deciding that I should kind of go do something, anything, but uh, still keep this in the back of my mind.

Anyway, to make a long story short on that part, we ended up moving here to San Angelo, ended up working at a department store as a sales lady. Uh, ooh [Laughs].

Just about the worst 8 to 5 job I could ever imagine that I was looking to do. [Laughs].

And I ended up having-it's really strange, but in the time that I spent in Rowena I made friends with a lot of customers that came in, a lot of prominent people that came in and always said what a good job I was doing, which was encouragement, but also offered me-

[Recorder malfunctions and cuts off]

Jennifer Rafferty: Okay, we're going.

BZ: Anyway, these customers had offered me positions to run a restaurant. They would back me. They had ranches. Lots of cattle. And we'd be in business. [Snaps fingers]. Just like that. Well, that, from my knowledge of the restaurant business, that's not how it works. I mean, first of all, you don't buy cattle off of the range. You have to buy cattle from the feedlot.

You can't just take a steer, have it slaughtered, run it through your restaurant. It has to be aged. There's a lot of parts of the cattle that you don't serve, and parts that you do.

So when it got to explaining to these people and thanking them. Of course, I'm sad in the process because I'm thinking I'm not going anywhere but putting a size twelve dress on a lady that definitely needs to wear a twenty [Laughs].

Anyway. So my days were just lost.

I was thinking, oh my gosh, I should have finished college. Did something. What was I ever thinking?

Anyway, in the process of this department store clerk, a lady came in and we got to be good friends.

She got to be a regular customer. And she heard that my name was-oops, I bumped into it. We'll start over on that part.

When she heard my name was Zentner, she said oh my gosh, what are you doing here? The, the Zentner name is synonymous with steaks and I have got someone you have got to meet.

And I'm thinking, oh my gosh, oh no, not another person I'm going to have to explain the whole routine, barnyard routine to.

Anyway, after a couple of weeks she arranged a meeting with her boss and myself. We met at Denny's restaurant. I remember as if it were yesterday. And uh, I was very nervous. And I'm thinking oh my gosh, I feel so intimidated [Laughs], because I'm gonna talk to this man about actually backing me or putting me in the business.

Of course in the back of mind there's that voice: you can't do it. You're a woman and it's a man's world.

Anyway, we talked for a while. He told me of a location that he had. It's in a shopping center that he owns.

And he's had two restaurants at this location and they've both gone under. Oh gosh, there's that challenge now. I can't wait to hear what my dad's gonna say now. Two men didn't make it at this place. Woman, what are you thinking? [Laughs].

Anyway, I'm just at that time after I thought about it, I can, I can do it. There was no fear. Which today I'd probably crumble and run. But I had no fear.

I, I was determined. I am not gonna sell another dress. I can do this.

So I, I listened to his story more. He told me he wanted me to come see the place. And he said the magic word-it's like a fairytale-but he says, you don't have to worry about one cent. All I need is your business knowledge of the restaurant.

Can you imagine? Oh my gosh. Nothing. I don't have to go in and ask my dad for money. I'm just gonna be voila! and I'm here in a business. Nothing. Oh, nothing.

Well, a couple of weeks went by. We, he called for me to come look at the business. I walked into this enormous building. I was overwhelmed.

I loved it. But I knew that if this was going to be a success, it was gonna be the family that was gonna make it successful, not Betty, but the family.

So I had to go talk to my dreaded dad [Laughs], about the thing that I'm gonna hear that I'm not gonna make it.

And after a couple of months of just pleading with him to just come look at the location and to tell him that this is what I really wanted to do, he said the next time, maybe, if he takes a trip to San Angelo, he would come by and might look at it.

It sounded pretty negative to me so I felt that probably it's not gonna happen. So I went to the next best thing-my mother, and asked Mother, would you talk to Dad on my behalf and just see if you might convince him to come look at it because I know that I'm gonna have to put the Zentner name out on the marquee, and if I don't have Mr. John Zentner's approval, there's not gonna be a Zentner name on the marquee.

We're slamming those plates over there [Laughs].

Anyway, oh I keep pushing that and you keep-

Anyway, he did come. He did walk into the business. He was skeptical at turning the key and opening the door, but after that first step in here, my dad's eyes lit up like a Christmas tree. All I could hear or all I remember him saying is,

"My God, if I had this place in Lowake, in Lowake, Texas, I could have done all sorts of things."

And all I was thinking was Yes [Laughs]!

I've got him!

Anyway, he started walking around and he looked at different parts of the restaurant. He loved the kitchen. It was large enough. He liked the walk-in box. It was large enough he could put his butcher shop in there.

And I'm just following him around. And going, I cannot believe. He is just on a roll and we're gonna open up a big cafe now.

Anyway, um, the business got started. I applied for my license. I did everything that you have to do to properly start a new business.

My dad was right by my side. My mother was here helping me. And the rest of my family were all here together. And opening day finally came. It was overwhelming. It was more than I expected. In fact, my parents had to end up selling their home in Rowena, buying a home here in San Angelo. My dad spent all of his time in the kitchen butchering meat, cooking. My mom was on the floor. The business had flourished, too.

We added on three more dining rooms, one that seats up to three hundred people. And it was, um, my fairytale story.

It was just an accomplishment that I could prove to my father that yes, it may be a man's world, and yes, I felt like everyday I was fighting what it, uh, the difficulty of owning a business.

But no matter what, I could do it. And I probably have to thank my father because had he not started off with saying "you can't," I probably wouldn't have.

But it was that ambition, that drive, that brought me to this business that I've been at for thirty-six plus years. And my dad stayed with me until he was ninety-four years old, running this business, and I have to say, he was so proud of Zentner's Daughter.

He would go to different towns and we'd stop at different places and someone would say, oh my gosh, your father came through here and he'd leave matches, Zentner's Daughter matches. And they go, we just love that man, we just love your place.

And I just glowed that he was so proud that I finally did something and accomplished it.

Okay, that was the end of take one [Laughs]. That's the fairytale part. Now do you want to hear the not so fairytale part [Laughs]?

AG: I mean, do you need a break or are you okay to keep going?

BZ: I'm, I'm on a roll [Laughs].

AG: Yeah, let's do it then!

BZ: Let me have a drink of- Got this story of how I um, got started-

AG: Yeah, your family's background.

BZ: [Laughs]. Oh, what a background, huh!

AG: Yeah.

BZ: [Laughs]. The-okay, I'll say that.

AG: No, no, no. If you have something else that you wanted to say about it, please.

BZ: Well I'm trying to think, what would be, what's the next, um, where do you want to go now?

AG: I think I had a follow-up question maybe that I wanted to ask you before we move away from the family history and restaurant history.

You had mentioned before we started recording um, some of your father's previous, um, jobs that he had had, in agriculture and butchering. Can you talk a little bit about what his background was and how that carried over into the restaurant and how that influenced your experiences.

BZ: I'm trying to word this or how to say it because my father, my mother was studying to be a nun.

She was going to the convent in San Antone. She just needed enough money for her bus ticket.

So she became a waitress at Lowake and uh, my dad convinced her that um, she really didn't want to be a nun.

She would just make an excellent wife and daddy could probably have her as a waitress for free now.

I mean, that's, he's got the tight German blood in him you know [Laughs].

So instead of my mother going to San Antone to become a nun, she married my dad and spent the rest of her life at his side in the business.

She packed up-I can remember us growing up, and this is kind of just a funny side joke, but my dad, like I said before, was not very stable as far as staying in one place. That's why I've been here for so many years. I'm never leaving one location. I learned a great lesson from my dad. You don't need to move around.

But this was um, my dad, if he decided to leave town on a whim, mother had three seconds to get all-there's three girls in our family, I'm the oldest. She had three seconds to get us all together, get out the door and head down the road.

She always kept a suitcase packed under the bed so she could just grab it, grab us three and go. I mean, it was just, right, that part.

But I think probably it has to back up with dad and how he was most of his life. Because from the stories that he would tell us, he started helping his dad as I said in their little saloon-type cafe.

Then he um, ended up- in those days, he'd tell us he had a buckboard and he would go from farmer's wife, the farmer's, the farmer's wife and he would do bordering. The first farm that he might stop at he'd buy a steer, a calf.

He'd go two more yards down the road and he'd butcher the calf, hang it up to a tree and butcher it, throw it on the back of the buckboard and go down to the next farmer's wife. And there he would sell the hindquarter, the leg, the tongue, whatever there was to sell and not actually receive cash for it. He would receive in return: chickens, eggs, pork, a hog, I mean, so, he was a traveling grocery store, going from-so before the evening was over with, gosh I can't imagine what he'd end up coming home with, but it was for their family.

But anyway, that was his relationship I think to the cattle butchering part. Then he would one time he was a butcher. Um, he was, made tons of trips to Fort Worth, hauling cattle, selling them at the Fort Worth stockyards, and supporting the family or himself in that manner.

He, um, he probably didn't really settle down as far as having a business per se, a business over two years. I can't even think of any time that I remember him having any type of, of settling background.

I think he opened, there are several places that he-[Laughs].

I don't know if I could record this one, but uh [Laughs] several places that he told me about-or told us about opening is, um, you see it on the gangster movies a lot where they have their dance halls.

But the men pay so much to dance with the women, to drink the beer. Like the old time saloons, with the, but I don't think it was a bordello, I hope it wasn't. I'm sure daddy didn't go as far as that.

But he did say that that he did have to pay the sheriff every Saturday night. He would come in and collect his portion of the money because they served alcohol. Um, his women dancers I think charged twenty-five cents for dancing. Daddy got ten or maybe he got fifteen cents and they got the ten. And they had to sell so much beer and drink so much, so that was one of his ventures that he had told me about or told us about.

I don't think he ever told it in a proud way. He just told us after somebody else would say the story, and daddy would have to get the story correct and tell us the right way.

So he did that and then he started thinking that he's opening um, Midkiff, was, which was how do you call, Connor [Hadacol Corner] at first, it's a town you'd say sort of in between Garden City and Midland, Texas.

It was an oil boom time, a lot of oil rigs, lot of rig workers, what do they call them, roughnecks, a lot of roughnecks working and he decided, yep, this is the place. I'm gonna open a restaurant, cafe, steakhouse slash whatever he decided to call it.

So out in the middle of a dust field, and this is dust country, he found an army barracks.

There were plenty of army barracks. In fact, I can't think of a restaurant that wasn't an army barracks to begin with. This is, was, easy to haul. Cheap [Laughs]. Plop it down, hook up some electricity, throw a couple of grills in, and there you go. You have a cafe, a John Zentner's kit cafe. String a few lights across the top. This was not an establishment that you'd have to worry about a dress code.

It was pretty much roughneck heaven. You got off the rig. Didn't matter how you looked. Walked in.

I'm sure that there were barrels for the tables and whatever daddy could find to throw on top, and, the chairs I'm sure were worn and rugged.

I vaguely remember, but I know that whatever it took to sell a fifty cent steak [Laughs], daddy would be there doing it.

And it was great. He had a wonderful business.

We lived in a small shanty, is what I remember, in the back of the restaurant. I probably, at that time, was five years old, four and a half to five years old,

and the reason I remember this place so well is that it probably, well it was- One afternoon, dad was talking that he was hungry for something to eat, and he asked mom to go cook him a steak and I said, "I will, I'll do it."

And, I really think that he thought I was just saying that, but I did. I actually cooked my first steak for my father in Midkiff, Texas.

Anyway, we stayed there. Mother was concerned because I was gonna start school the next year and she wasn't too happy with the school district. She should have not been happy with where we were living, forget the school.

But anyway, we uh, checked that the closest school was Garden City, which was probably an hour away.

And, by then, daddy was starting to get the itch, and he was ready to put those traveling shoes on anyway. There was something greener somewhere else, so he ended up selling it.

I don't remember all the details, but I think the next place opened, the next place we moved to was a place here in San Angelo on Avenue K. It was called Zentner's Fine Foods.

So we opened a place there. I was in the first grade. I went to Fort Concho School and um, one of our first waitresses that I remember was Dewees Paulson. She just passed away last year.

But she would always clean the counters and fuss at me after I got out of school that I'd mess up her counters. She worked for the Zentner Family for over sixty-seven years.

She was a waitress for me when I opened here.

And probably, oh not probably, she was the reason I attribute a lot of the success to the restaurant.

She was a hard working German lady. She was the ethics of saving money, so she watched everything that came through the back door, front door. Took care of our customers. She probably waited on four generations of families because people would come in here and they'd say I remember when I came in here with her, with my grandparents and my parents brought me here and now I'm here with my children, so.

And they'd always ask for Dewees. I loved that lady. She was special, hard-working, dedicated. I have to say, probably, just like the staff that I have here now.

A lot of them are from the restaurant that my father had, and they're still working here with me now.

One lady in particular, that you met when you came through the front door, is Bernice Johnson.

She just celebrated her 90th birthday. And she is a hostess, in fact, there's so much I'm talking about, I'm just rattling. And, um, okay.

About six months ago she fell and I was really concerned and the insurance company said that she was a big liability and had recommended that we have to let her go.

And I went, there's no way I can let Bernice go.

I mean, she absolutely lives for the next morning-I get emotional about this-but for the next morning to come to work.

Anyway, I suggested to her that we're probably going to have to cut her hours some, because she's working six days a week, she comes at 11 and leaves at 2, so we were going to cut it down to three days a week. And she was devastated.

In fact-you have to know Bernice-she told me it was age discrimination and she was gonna do something about it [Laughs]!

Anyway, we all laughed. She's working on only working three days a week. And I said "but you can come in here any day and visit" because she goes my customers all love me and miss me if I'm not here to see them. And believe it or not, those three days that she's not here, every customer that had not been in here for a month or a couple of months will come to me and go,

"what happened to the little lady up at the front? Is she still alive?" I went oh yeah oh we just cut her hours and she's working with the wage and hour board on my discrimination of [Laughs], age!

Anyway, but, I have to say, I have eight employees that are here now that worked with my father.

When I first opened up, nearly all my employees had worked for my father. So, with them, their background knowledge of the restaurant, I really didn't need my dad to start with! No, no, it was family. They're all family. They may not be blood family, but they're the backbone, they're the ones that made Zentner's Daughter. Okay, end of that chapter [Laughs].

AG: Thank you. That was, that was great.

BZ: Alright. Here, let me hold this for a while, rest your hand.

JR: Are you sure? Okay [Laughs].

AG: Okay well then you have to hold it up to me while I talk. Yes, ok.

Okay so then my next question would be after we've gone through all your family history and the history of the restaurants, can you tell us a bit about the food that you serve here and the menu itself?

BZ: The food that we serve at Zentner's Daughter has changed, it's changed a lot over the years.

We have to watch what the customer wants. Even though we started as a steakhouse, we serve primary steaks, the customer that comes in is at different times of the year, or years, tastes change, they look for something different.

Through the years there's been more of a variety of restaurants so you have to think, okay, I want to serve steaks to the people that want steaks, but I've got to get the other people that are driving up and down the highway here as well.

So I have to offer a menu that's gonna appeal to everyone's taste in that car. And they're not all hungry for steak.

So, we started serving chicken, grilled chicken, probably the most when the E-Coli scare came out.

No one wanted beef, the beef scare, oh my gosh, you'd die how many customers came in here wanting to know if we were serving Jersey cows, what was in our hamburger meat.

Unbelievable questions. We even showed them the beef raw, before it was served, so they could see what they were getting.

It was a challenge in itself, and I have to say that after a while the beef sales did pick back up but you could notice the decline that was in the serving of the beef.

So we found ways to serve the chicken breast. We had it seasoned with our garlic seasoning, which is something that my father had made famous serving, so we sold a lot of chicken. We picked up on seafood, sold a lot of catfish, shrimp, then we started adding steak and shrimp, kind of to boost the menu items and have different things.

We probably had to look at some menu items for the children to get there because a lot of times a parent is not going to come in and order a steak for his six year old kid to eat, so we have hamburgers, and I guess the west Texas favorite-and this has to sort of build up and change with times too.

There's times in the economy when things are down, a lot of people can't afford steak-but the all time favorite, the best buy, is the chicken-fried steak.

So the chicken-fried steak probably, I would have to say, is second to our KC family style steak.

So we serve chicken-fried steak that we tenderize, bread, and cook ourselves.

Everything that's served out of our kitchen is butchered in our butcher shop.

When my father first started, and when I first opened the steakhouse, we bought mainly hindquarters that we had hanging in the walk-in box. I would say we tried to do a twenty-one to twenty-seven day age on the beef that was hanging. And the reason for aging is the tenderness of the beef. The insides break down and therefore your beef is much tenderer. We don't use tenderizers that you sprinkle on it.

We did at one time buy beef that, just before the packer or after the packer would kill the cow, they'd do electrical shock, which they thought loosened the beef and it was tenderer, caused it to be tenderer. I never could tell the difference and I thought that aging of the beef was the best, best way to do it, so we've stuck to aging of the beef.

The only thing that has changed that when I bought it when I first opened as to when I buy it now is that you can't buy a hanging hindquarter.

Now everything's boxed and it's cryovac wrapped, and for us to get the age you either have to buy the beef, when you buy it you tell them that you want to know how many days age is on it now.

The majority of the beef that we get has twenty-one days age, and I think the aging of the beef has just been the background of me learning and associating the tender steaks, because my father would always tell me that you have to have the age on the beef.

And in the days when he did the butchering on the back of the buckboard, he would hang the, the calf that he just butchered, sometimes up to a week the calf would be hanging.

Now this is getting closer to dry aging. He would always make the comment-oh gosh-that he could [Laughs], scrape the green off of it. "Now that's when it's good," he'd say.

But, he always thought that while we're aging beef, I think he came up with this, his own vocabulary, and he said it's not ready to eat until it has a wang to it.

And it's crazy-I don't think I've ever heard anyone say wang-but he was quoted in Texas Monthly as saying this when they interviewed him, and now after that customers would come in and go I want to make sure that this beef that we're eating has that little bit of wang to it.

Of course they couldn't tell if it had it because you have to trim it off before you serve it. But that was a background history that I remember as part of-

I guess, you know if you think about it, a lot of other people that get into the restaurant business now, they really don't have the concept or an idea as to what it was that my father actually instilled in me, that I would know the tight side or the loose side of the beef, and you probably think, "Oh God, what, what do you mean, tight side and loose side?"

But in the pasture, the cow, the cattle they always lay, or you could say they lay, on one side.

They never lay on any other side but that one side. You're never going to go and see them lay on the opposite side.

So when dad and I would walk into the packer's walk-in box, he would go-in those days, you could go to the packer they'd give you a stamp with a pin on it, and you'd walk up and down these aisles of hanging beef, and daddy would have the Zentner name on the tag, and he would walk up and down and he would tag the beef with the tight side, the loose side, the one that he would make sure, because that was going to be the tender side of beef.

And then the packers in return, after three weeks, would deliver that beef to us. So he was always two weeks ahead buying beef. And it was there dangling in the walk-in box, his beef that he had picked out.

And naturally if you have a hindquarter, you have everything you need that's served in a steakhouse: from the round part of the hindquarter, the chicken-fries were made; from the loin part we could get the T-bones and the clubs; and then from the end, the butt-end, we would get the KC steak.

So, we had on the hindquarter, we had the whole menu, because the trimmings that were from the hindquarter, off the sirloin, were made into hamburger steak or hamburgers, so there was no waste. Even the fat that's trimmed off of the hindquarter, tallow is what they called it, was dropped into the fryers and rendered down for the grease to cook the french fries or to cook the steak fingers.

So there was no waste. Except, and this is one thing my dad had in the back of the steakhouse-wow this is so good, I go through all of these old memories-but there were thirty cats, we'd walk out the back door and all these cats would come running because daddy would take the kidney part that was hanging on the hindquarter and the cats got the kidneys.

And I swear, it was swish, just swarm to the door after we got through butchering-am I close enough? Still good? Okay. [BREAK]

BZ: Anyway, so the background, the background that I had with my father in the restaurant, was the best education anyone could get.

And I feel fortunate, like I said before, and lucky that I was able to learn, as dad would say, from the horse's mouth instead of actually going into some business, like some people do, and not really have the background. So I'm grateful for that.

And I feel like, I can say I can butcher anything in the walk-in. You could ask me any question about this place, and I'm confident I can answer that question. Okay, did that take care of that part of the menu?

AG: Yes! That was great. How are you doing?

BZ: I'm doing good. Bring it on!

JR: Okay, just make sure you hold it close [Referring to the microphone]. Are you still-

AG: So, talking about the education you received from your father, I'm curious then who in your family have you passed on and given this education to, and who will be the next one to come into-

BZ: Excellent question. Because I've been asking that myself now for the past twenty-two years [Laughs]!

I brought up my children just as I was brought up. I have a boy, a son-he's a grown man, listen to me-Sean, and a daughter, Kim, which you all met earlier.

Their interest in the restaurant business was just like me: they wanted nothing to do with it.

Growing up, I couldn't even get them to bus tables. I was made to do it, but, not them. They pretty much had their minds on doing other things.

And of course I sometimes think that a lot of it had to do with, I was used to the fact that my parents were in the restaurant all the time. So I didn't see-the restaurant was the family and family life.

My children were brought up in a different generation and the restaurant took from their family life. And I know that today because they tell me so many times that I wasn't at their basketball games, or baseball games, their confirmation, so many things that I missed. And if it was Mother's Day, we definitely spent Mother's Day working at the restaurant.

So they, I think, they had a hate for the business because it took away so much of their years growing up.

But, as time has gone by and my son graduated from high school, he decided to go to Tarleton [he attended Sull Ross in Alpine, Texas], and he went into, he was going to work in the beef industry. He went into agriculture, he worked in butchering, he worked in inspection of beef, he juggled that between going to college and rodeoing, and so the fun part kind of took off, and after a while, he has worked here with me in the restaurant.

If I am busy and need help, he lives in Stephenville [Texas] presently, he does come down to help me on occasions.

He has brought up to me that he might be interested in opening a restaurant of his own, of course here I go with that in the back of my mind, now I know where dad got it from, because I'm thinking no way! He can't run a restaurant! Oh dear.

But I would never keep it from him, the only thing I would suggest is work here, take over this place, I'm ready to retire-not really, but if the chance ever comes I'd step aside a little and let him come in but presently he is raising his family and enjoys Stephenville, and his wife is a realtor and he is an insurance adjuster.

And still rodeos, by the way, and what greater town that Stephenville, Texas?

My daughter, Kim, she's here, she works with me in the restaurant. She's very good, she's very observant, but she still wants her free time and she still wants to be with her children, so the interest is lacking a little.

Although every day she catches a lot of things that I miss, so I have to say every day I see that maybe the prospects of her being in the business are good.

My granddaughter, on the other hand, has taken a bigger interest. She, right now, is going to college. And she was, she's changed her major now seventeen times a day-no [Laughs]! But she was interested in being a nurse, then she started with NCIS on TV and says she wants to be just like that, so whatever next show comes up I guess on TV that's popular she'll take off on it.

But she does enjoy the business.

And I don't have a doubt in my mind that this will not continue.

I'm certain that one of them, one of them, will take off with it, and I'm going to push it because I'm not really ready to hang up the knife and fork. I'm still interested in being here, like my dad, another thirty years would be fine.

And I guess I could sit out front like he used to do and hand out apples as the customers leave. Okay, cut [Laughs]!

AG: Okay, we're moving on to the next thing. I do have some more questions, are you still-

BZ: Sure, I'm going! I'm rocking and rolling!

AG: Okay, so I would like to know, I have a few more categories of questions that I would like to ask you about.

BZ: Okay!

AG: So, I would like to get back to the restaurant. So if you could talk a little bit about-here, I'm going to put the mic right here so that I can get this question in-can you tell me about the décor of the restaurant, and tell me a little bit about what is on the walls and then we'll go from there.

BZ: Sure. The décor now and the décor that was.

We experienced a fire in 1997 that completely destroyed Zentner's Daughter. It was in December.

We still haven't totally decided what caused it, although I'm pretty sure that it had to do with the Christmas lights that were up, or maybe a candle that wasn't blown out.

But the décor of Zentner's Daughter was, in the beginning, more of a rustic, ranch house, steakhouse type that you can see, maybe, oh, San Francisco. We had carousel horse, horses hanging from the ceiling, we had the dark red carpet, the décor was this hunter green and dark red, it was very western nostalgic, cowboy-type, anything that you can imagine you'd see in the ranch, the barn house or whatever, was tastefully done, but it was western.

After the fire, times had changed. I was looking more at something that was lifting, airy, lighthearted. I like still the San Francisco-type theme but more the Victorian.

And so we found stained glass, we found etched glass, we did a lot of-oh, what is it that you call it-the Victorian-type awnings.

We picked up a lot with the family because of the family history. I have my grandfather's painting that's in the back room that sort of shows him in the saloon time with a bottle of whiskey, or if other customers come in and don't necessarily want to see a man, an old man, holding a bottle of whiskey it could be a bottle of medicine or something, ha.

But anyway, it's décor that I think is me.

It's more, and I, I don't know, I'd describe it as uplifting.

There's a lot of the red stained wood. I didn't want to make it too feminine, but I still wanted it to be pleasant and appealing, and I think that it would be, along with your meal, a good dining experience. I think it appeals to the younger people that may come out for a date or it appeals to the older couples that come in and can relax. And it's definitely childproof, because my grandkids have torn through every part of this place.

AG: Can you tell us specifically about the paintings on the wall of this room?

BZ: Oh, I'd love to. This room is called-every room in the steakhouse has a name, and it's all family names-

This room in particular is the Josephine room that she's talking about and it has four paintings of four girls in white dresses.

And of these paintings, a lady painted, and when we first started, we were just going to do-I was in the grandma stage, and I wanted pictures of my granddaughters, that's all I wanted, I came with this big long portfolio of pictures of them and of course she's going, now, Betty, not everybody's going to be as fond of your granddaughters as you are, and I think she was swaying towards where she would like to put her own special taste in the paintings as well.

So I pulled pictures up that I have. One is of my grandmother, Caroline Feist Zentner, and this was a pose that she had when she was looking up at my grandfather August Zentner, and her hands are on her hips and her demeanor was, she looked as though she was angry, looking at him when the picture was taken.

But now you see just the picture of a young girl that was of her with her hands on the hips, and it's a pleasant picture, kind of uplifting.

And then you look at the picture that's next to it and it's a little girl holding tulips, which is my granddaughter, but it also is a portion of my daughter.

In fact, someone had just commented that they're all the same person, aren't these pictures all the same person? And they're not. They are all family, and naturally I guess the Zentner family has good strong genes because you can look at any of the pictures and you can see my daughter Kim, you can see my granddaughter Spring.

Another picture you see my granddaughter Bree or Haylee. And, another picture you look at it and you can see my Aunt Josie, who that room is named for, you see her in it, as well as some people said you can see me in it.

So the pictures in here are family, and you look at it different ways and see different things. But we have other pictures in the steakhouse that are painted.

Sort of the old world pictures that kind of are soothing, relaxing, laid back.

We have a bar up in the front part that has stained glass windows that, the room is called Johann, and Johann is named after my father John, because people would call him Johann.

Another room is the Adelaide room, which is my sister that had passed away with MS, so I named it the Adelaide room.

The back room, there's a room, it's called the Louise room, it's named after my mother, and, of course, in the very far room it's the Victorian, and that's just because it's of Victorian décor.

And that's the rooms. In all, we seat eight hundred people, we have four private dining rooms, and one seats up to three hundred.

AG: Can you tell me a bit about your choices for the employee uniform and the flatware, what goes on the table. Can you describe that a little bit?

BZ: Oh dear, okay [Laughs].

Geez, how do I tell you.

First of all, you remember earlier I talked about my father and how he started the business, and first he started with, oh gosh, the tables, the chairs, whatever it took to put it together. The important thing is, is what you're serving, you want that steak to be the best cut steak, you want that steak to be the most tender.

As far as having the most shiny crystal, the best silverware, the best uniform, I probably have lacked and don't put that much emphasis on.

In fact, I probably have the worst silverware, ha, I probably have, could've done better on the plates,

but at the time and as things are I don't see putting a lot of money on the silverware, the big heavy flatware all to go down into the garbage can, ha, when they throw it away, because we probably on a basis throw away, I couldn't even tell you, the dishwashers we're buying, replacing that silverware every week.

So it's not, this will be something that you kind of, I picked up from my dad and I not necessarily think that most expensive or the most lavish of something is most important. And there is some things that I've spent a little more money on, as far as the décor is what they see.

I do have steak knives, and good steak knives, but as far as anything else, no.

And, yes, do sometimes customers comment on it and say I think you could pick out a little bit better type of flatware, better plates for a place like yours, and of course I want to step back and say, well, it's what I'm putting on the plate, and I don't think you should have to pay for the silverware, the dishes or the plates to cover the cost. If you just pay for the steak that you're eating, I'll take care of the rest, and maybe what you call cutting corners, or, I think it's just being frugal.

AG: I like that philosophy. Speaking of which, what would you say is your philosophy as a restaurant owner and for Zentner's Daughter?

BZ: Explain that to me a little more.

AG: So, you talk about not wanting to spend a lot of money on the flatware, the silverware because you don't want to hand over the cost to your customers, or you talk about having a real family environment. That the restaurant to you, is the family.

So if you, we bring all these themes together that we've been talking about, what would you say is one theme that you could describe as, yes that is my philosophy, when I walk into work every day. That is what I'm taking with me, and that's what I want my restaurant to represent.

BZ: Ok, I'm going tell you something that my father told me, long time ago.

When I first opened here, I thought, wow, this great big huge gorgeous place. I got a big head, got a little bit outside the, no, you don't want to say outside the box in a sense but got to thinking, wow, okay, I can do tons of things, I'll make this like no place you've ever seen.

And then I was put back a couple of steps and my dad looked at me and he says, "you know Betty, I'm going to tell you something," because he asked me, he says, "what are your plans? What do you want to do, where do you want to go from here?" And I'm thinking, oh my god, I'm at the top now, where do I want to go. This is me, this is my life.

TV, advertising on TV, advertising in magazines, advertising in the paper.

And he looked at me and he says, "you don't need to spend money on advertising on TV, in the paper, in magazines, on the radio, you need to put what you do best on the plate. And after you put this on the plate and you serve it to your customers, they will advertise to the world for you."

So if I have to say, one philosophy as to what I feel the strongest about, it comes from the kitchen. If I serve the best I possibly can, you know, you're only good as the last meal you served.

I kind of use that as my motto.

Anyway, in fact I have it on my door, every morning I see it when I walk in the office. "If you give it to the customer, you serve it on the plate, they get what they expect, what they're paying for"-

[speaking to her staff] Bree, Bree, Bree, [Speaking to AG].

I think I was, was I through on that one?

Serve it on the plate, oh.

"If you put it on the plate, then you've please, and you've pleased the customer, they'll do the advertising for you. But always have to remember you're only as good as the last meal you served."

AG: That seems like a good philosophy to me.

BZ: [Laughs].

AG: So regarding advertising, I see that you have a lot of articles written about you that you've hung up on your walls, can you talk about those a little bit?

BZ: Without bragging. I have to say, gosh, I have been blessed, blessed, with wonderful customers that have come in here, just like you two. Wow, that was quite an honor to be called and asked for, is this an audition, what would I call this? Tell me what I'm doing?

AG: You're giving us an oral history.

BZ: Okay, to, oh, wow, okay. To give an oral history of Zentner's and Zentner's Daughter, I could just, I get emotional even saying that because I feel that this is just not me. This is something that my father, I keep saying my dad, my mom worked just as hard side by side with my dad all those years to serve, to serve a tradition.

And that's what we're doing, we're serving a tradition that was started by my father. And to have it preserved as you guys are going to do is great, it's fabulous, it's, it's something that's never, never going to be gone. It's something I wished [Sighs],

I wished that my dad would be sitting here next to me, because I know [Pause]

that there's so much about him I have missed and how I'd love to have it recorded it as well.

Oh gosh. This is, this is by far the best.

You can't tell I'm a daddy's girl, can you.

Two years ago, I was honored to receive by the Texas Restaurant Association, a very honorable award. I was inducted to the hall of honor, and that probably was a-notice I always say that probably a bunch, I got to stop saying that-it was a evening that I won't ever forget, it was, that was like my fairy tale story with the evening ending as it did.

A super, super addition to the legacy that my father had bestowed on me, and my mother. Which was probably the highest honor anyone in the restaurant industry could receive and wow [Laughs], I did it.

We've been recognized by Texas Monthly, with quite a few articles, in fact, I had, I'm paging through this, because this is so, one of it was, said that Zentner's Daughter is among the eateries listed in the 1992 Mobile Travel Guide. We were also on, listed on Zignet as one of the places to eat. Texas Monthly also added that, um-oh my gosh, this is what I wanted to talk about.

Um [Pause], I'm glad you all are editing, I'm just near-but it put on here, um, August [Unintelligible 01:18:01]-Come in! [Shouts to someone knocking at the door].

I guess it's not coming in. Okay, this is take two on stuff being mentioned, cut, cut, start over.

Also, we were in Texas Highways as San Angelo is among the top one and half percent of restaurants in the state according to the March issue, that-well, not San Angelo, Zentner's Daughter of San Angelo is among the top one and a half percent of restaurants in the state.

Money magazine did an article of Zentner's Daughter and boasted about the T-bone steaks,

We've had people that were putting cookbooks together, Texas on the Half Shell that did a write up of the restaurant.

Um, there's been awards with Texas Restaurant Association, with Restaurateur of the Year, um [Pause] and I'm proud to say that in two years my husband which I am so proud of is going to be the President of the Texas Restaurant Association.

So I think, um, our involvement with the industry, our involvement with our customers, our involvement with our family and most of all, our involvement with our employees are probably, um, our best part or are part of being so recognized. I don't know what else, there's tons of, you wouldn't want to just sit here and read through-da da-

AG: I mean if you're okay with it can we take some pictures of them.

BZ: Yes, oh gosh, yes.

AG: Ok, we can do that after.

BZ: Yeah, in fact there's tons of stuff in both of these, you can, my spittoon, that's what I call it [Laughs], my whatever receptor, whatever they gave me as a hall of honor [Laughs], is up there at the front. So, yeah, no, I'm, I'm proud, I, I get to where now if something is going on, if something's going on, I hate saying, it's like almost you're bragging, but it's, I'm proud, it's, it's something that I know I didn't do alone. And I could have never done without the backing of all those people that were there to help me. Take three. Next.

AG: Yeah that was great. Thank you.

Um, so, my next question is kind of along those same lines then.

What do you think brings your customers coming back? What brings them here in the first place, and what keeps them bringing back?

BZ: I have no idea [Laughs].

AG: Coming back?

BZ: Okay, why do customers, why do customers keep coming back? Why do customers keep coming back? Gosh, first and foremost, I hope it's because of the food. I mean, that would be why I would want them to keep coming back, but I also feel I have customers that come in here to eat every day.

I don't even eat here every day. I can't help but think you would just get tired of eating the same thing, so I'm going to say the second thing I hope that they would be coming back for is just the friendliness, the atmosphere, the love that I have for these customers.

It's if something happens and they don't come in, I don't see them for a while, we want to find out, are they still okay? So, I'd have to say, the reason, the second reason that they come in here is because they feel at home. And they feel like they're a part of the place. So, food, number one and home, number two.

AG: So along those lines then, can you describe what you believe Zentner's Daughter's role to be in the community of San Angelo?

BZ: Okay, hold it close [Referring to the microphone]. The role of Zentner's Daughter in the community, for a long time-there's somebody that's tapping on the window, that's what sounding-okay, the role Zentner's Daughter in the community is very important. Very important.

In fact, the role of any business, not necessarily Zentner's Daughter has to be established with your community.

First of all, your community is what and who gives to your business. So you want to give back, and you always hear, I want to give back to the community.

Well giving back, or giving to the community, we are involved in the San Angelo stock show and rodeo, we are huge supporters of the stock show.

Um, we try to buy the grand reserve champion, um, we don't serve it, but we do help parc, participate in the process. These kids work hard, um, they are the backbone of the beef industry and henceforth we are a part of that industry.

Um, I, I was on the board of the Chamber of Commerce, we, my husband has served and was the director on the board of the Chamber.

We are members of the Better Business Bureau, we support the West Texas Rehab, we help with a function called the Spring Chicken Affair which all the proceeds goes to rehab of all the resident, rehab of all the residents in the West Texas community. Gosh, there's a list of things. We, ah, just this summer when the fires were so bad, and we were surrounded by I can't even tell you how many grass fires and how many homes it destroyed, we put together, we called other restaurants in this area, asked them to help us donate food, we went and picked up the food for two weeks and delivered it to the firemen that were on the outside of town.

Um, serving them, in fact we served them two meals a day, some other restaurants picked up and served breakfast, so it was, um, and we didn't just do it. It was just our effort to begin with, to help give back to the community.

We have helped raise money for different things and different functions that's come into town. Um [Pause],

I, I-don't want to say that there's a division between helping the community, or involvement in the community, because I think we are a community, we're a part of the community, so we're just giving to help those that helped us. And it's one, I don't know what the word is I'm trying to say, but it's one group helping each other.

And, we don't mind if somebody needs help, and it doesn't have to be a group, I have people that come in, once a week that wants to put a bucket up front for a donation for someone that's been diagnosed with cancer.

I'm a cancer survivor, so I'm involved in the Relay for Life. I've given talks to cancer survivors, it's, it's not even so much about, ah, what Zentner's Daughter is, it's what, what each one, of we are as an individual, as what Betty Zentner does, and what Bernay [Sheffield] does, it's us as a group.

So, it's important, it's very important, that you become a part of your community. So, it's not giving it's a part of the community, and you all work together. [Pause] Next.

AG: Okay, so we're going to start wrapping up here. Um, I would like to ask you, what is one of your most memorable moments since opening the restaurant if you had to pin point one.

BZ: Oh god it just flashed in front of me. What do you think it would be?

AG: I want to hear you say it.

BZ: [Laughs]. Just when you asked the question the first thing that flashed into my mind which is probably the most memorable moment was the fire. Cause that absolutely happened at 3 O'Clock in the morning, I was called at home, I [Sighs] couldn't believe that the fireman is telling me, my business is on fire. So that would have to be, probably the most memorable and devastating because it was, um [Pause], it was almost at that time, the rebuilding of Zentner's Daughter. Was it going to rebuild, was I going to reopen? And of course, yes. And then the good part of something that I remember the most was, [Coughs] is showing my dad that, yes it's a man's world, but guess what? They made room for this old gal [Laughs].

AG: So, are there any other stories that you would like to share with us that we haven't touched upon?

BZ: Do you have all day [Laughs]? There's, there's so many, there's so many stories, I'm going to, I'll tell you what you'll have to do. I'm going to write a book, I've got the title, and I've got ten thousand unbelievable stories employees come up with excuses of why not to show up for work, what happened to them, why they couldn't be here, why they didn't give good service to a customer, what in particular happened to this, why, eh, uh, the other day and my father-I'm going back, back, was back-and he thought he ran over an employee, but in fact it was a hind quarter that someone was trying to steal out the back door [Laughs].

So if you get a chance and I get the time, I'm going to write a book, and it's going to be, As the Steak Burns and Your Stomach Turns.

AG: Perfect [Laughter]

AG: Do you have anything that you want to ask?

JR: Do you want to maybe share one story with us?

BZ: Wow, oh, okay let's see here. I have to think on this one, let me see if I can-cut it off, let-[recording device turned off upon request of BZ]

[Interview resumes with a story about Mi Tierra restaurant in San Antonio, TX]

BZ: And this is so, um [Pause], I just went blank. What is his name-

AG: Are we talking about Emmett?

BZ: No, his brother, uh, um, darn it. Ok, he's the kind of person that comes up to me and makes me feel like I'm the president of the United States, that it's so great for us to be friends. When I'm just going, oh my god, are you crazy, you are fabulous, you are such an icon, my gosh, your place is so super, I love going there. You know, it's so, he's that kind of person. He's just so wonderful in that sense.

AG: How did you two first meet?

BZ: He came, we see, how did-somebody, a friend of his came to the restaurant, and they came here, and he, whoever this friend was-I'm getting so old, introduced me to him. And we got to talking and he tells me he's heard of our place and whatever, and I'm thinking, oh my gosh, thank you, thank you but, let me tell you I have always loved your restaurant. Every time we go to San Antone or any time I just recommend people, it's just like the place that you, if you're throwing names out there, that's what you [Laughs], throughout or whatever, and his involvements. Because he was the president of the Texas Restaurant Association, so, our involve-involvement with it, we got to be friends.

We took a trip to Mexico, which was, oh my god. This was like, the trip of all trips, this is where restaurateurs went in as restaurateurs and we were taken to different places, something that you would of loved, because it was showing the culture of the restaurant and how these places, little mom and pop places, because that's special to me, because I just feel, you know, this is where all the history and starting of things are, is these immigrants that came in and started their livelihood. And you can see the passion in these little bitty places.

But their food was fabulous, and their, their, um mannerisms, the whole thing about them, was, like you, like I want to be, make people feel so welcome that they're at home, and that they're definitely a guest, and you want to take care of them, and make them-and it's so true, this culture, and being with him and being there, and we go to all these places, and he introduces us to these people, it was super.

I remember sitting in one restaurant, and the whole family, after they prepare-I think there was, like, thirty of us, and they were just so, you know, so gracious and glad that we were there, and after they finished all, doing all the cooking, the whole family comes out, and they take a bow, and they're bringing you some other samples of something they've put together, and it was just-I loved it, I just absolutely [Pause]

I guess it made me proud of my heritage, because I could almost see my dad and my grandfather, going, "The first bite you take, do you like?" "Is it ok?" "More?" "Ok?" You know, it was important that, that you were happy, and if you weren't, I'm gonna go make it right, and it just kind of gave you that, Gosh, that's what I want to be, I want to do, I couldn't wait to get home.

And they gave it to me, those people [Pause] [Sighs]

See how passionate I get? Gave me the passion for that part. And I loved it. Loved to see it. And you don't see it, and that's sad. All that's gone. You just don't see it. Oh Lord! You think I'd be on my period or something, I'm just sitting here bawling [Laughs]. Oh Lord! [END INTERVIEW] [1:35:33, End Part 2]