Arthur Brown: Interview [Side B]

  • [Interview Transcript from the book "Psychedelic Psounds". First part of interview is available at http://av.cah.utexas.edu/index.php/Vorda:Da_00102]
  • AV: How did you get signed by Pete Townsend and Track Records?AB: Townsend had been interested in signing the Bonzo Dog Doo Dah Band, but Track Records missed them as they had just been signed by another label. So Townsend told Track Records that if they didn't hurry up and sign our band, then they would get picked up. At the time, we were being wined and dined by every record company in England. We had never had so much free food in our lives. The record companies could tell the Crazy World of Arthur Brown wasn't just a local phenomena. Something was going to happen with this band. So Track Records signed us up.
  • AV: You previously told me that your first record was supposed to be a concept album, but that Kit Lambert, the producer, didn't think it would sell. Consequently, Lambert had you record a couple of cover songs on side two. What was the concept album like and how did you decide what cover songs to do?AB: Initially, we used to do "I Put a Spell On You" and "Money" on stage, but we didn't want to put them on the album. I felt that the songs I had written with Vincent should have been put out since the concept was an integral thing. Initially, Lambert didn't want me to put any concept out, not even side one. I told Lambert I thought he was wrong. Finally, he said I could do one side and he would decide what to put on the other side.
  • AV: Why didn't you ask Pete Townsend to convince Lambert to release it as a concept album?AB: It may have worked, but at that time nobody knew "Fire" was going to be a hit. Lambert was wondering how he could sell this. I was very inexperienced. I hadn't spent much time in London, didn't know the industry, and I was more concerned with the music. I was just someone who was naive at that time. I felt if Lambert wanted to try it then we would try it since side one was intact. There were two other songs that were suppose to be on side two, but I don't think we ever did record them. What I remember about those songs is something about the forces of enlightenment throughout the universe and other angelic figures.
  • AV: How did the album get its great cover by David King as well as that fine solarization photo of you by David Montgomery on the back cover?AB: Lambert and Chris Stamp (brother of the actor, Terence Stamp) were looking for something artistic. Initially, we had a guy do a wood cutting of me. Although it was a very good idea, it didn't have enough drama. Then they got David King to do the ultraviolet photo of me on the cover and David Montgomery to do the solarization. So it wasn't only at places like the UFO Club, but all the other artistic mediums were experimenting as well. They were looking for something photographically that would be as far advanced as the music.
  • AV: How did you and Vincent Crane write the songs?AB: We would sit together over the piano or sometimes the keyboards. Vincent, who had been classically trained, and I were very open with each other at that time. I would say to him, "Here's the lyric and he would play something to make it fit. Then I would say, "No, not that chord. It needs to be a little more stretched." It was a reciprocal effort where we both had freedom for our own ideas and input, but I normally supplied the lyrics and melodies.
  • AV: The Crazy World of Arthur Brown LP on side one could be described as a hallucinogenic trip into Dante's Inferno. What role did drugs play with the making of this album?AB: Not much. I was drinking a lot in those days. I once had a joint and that was it.AV: "Dynamic explosions in my brain" are the first words you sing on the album and certainly seem to reflect a hallucinogenic state.AB: I always used to have reasonably vivid dreams and very often symbolic dreams. It just came together for what was going on for me. I think when I write I tend to write dramatically so I wanted a whole sequence to represent the interior reality of a person.Altered states can come about through various means--- breathing techniques, trance-dancing, fear in war-time, to name just a few. They can also happen through psychedelic drug-states---but these are by no means the only route. It's also an area poets like Blake, who wasn't particularly a drug user, could reach.
  • AV: How did you come up with such an outrageous scream as evidenced in the opening song "Prelude-Nightmare" where you sing, "Take that fire about from my brain!"?AB: It was when they removed my third testicle. Actually, I'd perfected that in the piano room at the Reading University Students Union. I couldn't really play, but I decided that I might be able to sing. I had heard James Brown on record, but also I went to see a concert where Steampacket was playing and Long John Baldry did a good gospel scream. I thought I could do that. I spent three or four months working at it and what developed was a very reinforced falsetto.
  • AV: Who provided violins, flute, and horns for the album?AB: It was Kit Lambert's idea because Atlantic, who brought the album over to America, said the drummer didn't keep good enough time. So Lambert decided that instead of re-recording he would find a way to bury it. So Lambert buried the drums under the brass and string arrangements which Vincent Crane did. The actual playing of the brass and strings was done by various other people.
  • AV: Discuss the song "Fanfare-Fire Poem" and such lyrics as, "And I breathed in/and there was smoke in my lungs/and fire in my brain."AB: That lyric was written when I was sixteen which was 1960. It was more or less entering that interior state. It was largely inspired by Blake and Milton.AV: So when you have the lyrics "and there was smoke in my lungs/ and fire in my brain," it wasn't related to the use of drugs?AB: No.
  • AV: "Fire" was your hit single which hit #2 in America in October 1968. It starts out with your unforgettable scream, "I am the god of hellfire! And I bring you fire!" How was this song written which features your tremendous screaming vocals along with Vincent Crane's driving organ?AB: I started out with a theme and then I came up with the lyrics and character to go with it. So it was a character from the theme from which "Fire" was later pulled off as a single.AV: Did you have any idea the single would be "Fire"?AB: No. In fact it was chosen when we were in the middle of our first American tour. The album arrived and the single arrived and that was it. We didn't have much to do about the choosing of it.In fact, we did another song at that time called "Give Him a Flower" which was the one all the underground audiences joined in on. They loved singing it since it was a pisstaking of the whole flower power scene. Lambert, Stamp, and Townsend decided between them they wanted somethinga little harder. They even wanted me to leave the band so I could be a solo artist. They were trying to choose something that would project an image into the future which is why "Fire" was chosen because it had quite a good range of vocals.
  • AV: "Come and Buy" is another Brown-Crane composition which is my favorite song on the album and should have been a hit single in its own right. The violins sound like they are being played by devils from a Salvador Dali painting. The song has excellent drumming, organ, and vocals. There is also that wonderful transition from adagio (slow tempo) to allegro (fast tempo) that occurs three times within the song. You also ask, "Why is it so cold out here?" to which you reply in a demonic voice: "The price of your entry is sin."AB: "The price of your entry is sin" is actually a reprise that comes from the first track "Nightmare" and this occurs at the end as well in "Time" and "Confusion." There are reoccurring themes because I wanted to have it like an opera where themes reoccur and reflect on new things that have arisen in the music.The title is part of the character, the God of Hellfire, which speaks for itself. The opposite part of fire is you can go in there and it won't burn you or destroy you. It's more bathing in the light. For me, it was the condition or the awareness your soul is in. If you are unfocused, off balance, and away from what you are in life, then it's going to be the demonic side. If you're not, then it's the other side; but it's all a whole.AV: What state were you in at that time?AB: I think it was always a combination.
  • AV: "Time" (Arthur Brown) and "Confusion" (Vincent Crane) are listed as two separate songs, but, strangely enough, as one track. "Time" has that grave movement where the lyrics state, "And find, at its source, the Great Belief, already murdered/all things have a pattern." Is this an existential statement saying, like Camus or Sartre, that God is dead?AV: No, in actual fact, it's my bad verbalization. What it actually says iS: "And find at it's source, a green leaf already muddied."AV: So for all these years I've been misinterpreting the actual lyrics.AB: It doesn't really matter, does it? That's the beauty of poetry. There have been other things that have been incorrectly pointed out. For example, there was a Japanese version of the album where some guy sat down in front of the speakers and put down what he thought he heard and it bore no resemblence whatsoever. It's the only version on this album with the lyrics on it, and it is completely wrong.
  • AV: "Confusion" picks up the crescendo considerably while echoing several of the lyrics used in the previous songs. Side one ends with your demonic laugh, Theaker's angular drumming, and the casading notes from Crane's organ. Where would side two have gone if you had been permitted to do so?AB: Side two would have ended where it did with "Child of My Kingdom." I do remember Lambert, after I showed him side one, saying, "Can't we end it on a more hopeful note?" said, "No, the idea is that one side ends dramtically and the other side ends pleasantly." The idea for the whole thing, although there was a movement and a theme, was that you could play either side first and it would make sense, depending on which way you wanted it to end.
  • AV: What was your reaction to the addition of strings and horns? Do you think it enhanced the music and were you pleased with it?AB: I did like a lot of it. I thought some bits of it were a little twee. For instance, "Come and Buy," which I now quite like, incorporated one of the violin riffs which was, almost note for note, stolen from an Esso gasoline advertisement which I detested. Drachen hates it and he thinks the original trio version of it is far superior. I quite like having the added textures.
  • AV: Side two starts with the great cover of Screamin' Jay Hawkins' "I Put a Spell on You." Why was this song included?AB: It was one of our stage numbers that was very popular, but a lot of other bands covered it including the Alan Price Set who had a hit with it in England in 1966 after Alan Price had left the Animals.
  • AV: "Spontaneous Apple Creation" appears to be one of the concept songs that was kept and features some bizarre organ playing, especially at the end.AB: I remember talking to Townsend about it saying, "I don't know if this one should really go on the album since we haven't finished the tune." He said, "Just do it as it is." So it was spoken and then sung. The music was purely Vincent's response to it. It was because of his background in classical music that he took a rhythmic approach as opposed to doing a blues break. One also has to give credit to Drachen because there were very few drummers who would have gone along with that.
  • AV: Was "Rest Cure" one of the concept songs?AB: No. I wrote the tune and lyrics while sitting down on a tube train. I was playing with different sounds in my mouth, and out came the line "When this world is getting you down." It was a bit of an attempt to sound like some of the West Indian bands. So I took it from there and wrote "Rest Cure."
  • AV: "Money" is a fine cover of the James Brown tune. How much of an influence was James Brown since you not only could scream like him, but your dancing on stage was also reminiscent of him?AB: A great deal for both singing and dancing. I saw his live show when I was in Paris and I was impressed not only with his singing and dancing, but he was one of the few performers that had each row of his orchestra co1or- matched but dressed differently; and the lighting played on all of these colors. It was just devastating to see.My dancing influence really began from watching English television because we were more into co1onizing Africa and such than America had been. I saw a lot of documentaries of African tribes dancing and that's where I got a lot of my ideas, although I never became as supple as those guys. That's where I drew a lot of the influence which can be seen in pop dancing with the Watusi and the Twist.
  • AV: "Child of My Kingdom" concludes side two. It starts out as a moody-blues piece and then goes into a jazzy improvisation which shows the bands multi-dimensional talents.AB: I have to say the chorus "for once in my life" I found to be a little poppy for my taste at the time, but it seemed to work. That was one of the tracks that John Marshall played drums on. At that time I was not satisfied with it because what I was listening to was Indian music. "Child of My Kingdom"was based around the Indian type of modulation and I wanted it to sound like that. When the piano parts came in I just said, "Oh, God, we have the same boring music." Listening back to it now, it was a pretty good blend of the two.I was never really satisfied with the musical sounds even when I was with the Crazy World. I tried to persuade Keith Emerson to join, who at the time was with the Nice, because he was making incredible sounds on his organ. I was looking for a different sort of sound than what we were making with Vincent. We were all working together, but we were into different things and I just wanted a much more experimental sound.
  • AV: What was Keith Emerson's response about joining you?AB: Keith said it was a nice offer, but he was tied up with the Nice and it didn't work out. Those were the days I was going to do a project with the Floyd. The proposal from Hendrix to form a band came in 1969. It was a very creatiave atmosphere in those days and if you're creative you certainly want to be doing different things. Peter Gabriel, until he'd done Passion, was probably experiencing similar problems because he was creatively infuriated by what he was having to put on record. His music was good and it was exploring a certain part, but there were whole other avenues he wanted to explore.
  • AV: My brother saw the Crazy World tour in late 1968 at Arizona State University and said it was the most amazing concert he had ever seen. He described Arthur Brown being lowered onto stage by a crane, wearing a flaming helmet, dancing on one foot across the stage like James Brown, and having this great voice. The concerts left an indelible impression on those who saw you, but the tour ended up being a financial disaster. It has also been stated the band was unable to capitalize on its initial success due to constant touring and to "the ingestion of large amounts of mind-altering substances" by members of the band. What happened on this tour?AB: We actually did three tours. The first tour was quite sucessful for the level it was on. We played with all the big American bands like Jefferson Airplane, the Doors, and the Mothers. Just before the first tour we were a top draw in England despite not having a hit record which was quite an achievement. People like Hendrix refused to play with us as support band because they were worried about getting blown off. I have reviews from my tours with the Who that said we made the Who look wooden.
  • AV: When was the first tour?AB: The first tour was in 1967 and was actually very successful. The one we did in 1968 was way over priced. We just had a big hit and they decided to ask for a phenomenal amount of money for the tickets which resulted in a lot of empty seats. I also think the theatrics largely took over and we got too visual. We were still playing the same material and we virtually lived in America as our last tour lasted six months. It just got to be too boring, particularly for Vincent.
  • AV: At what point did the group become involved with drugs?AB: I'm not sure, but I think, certainly on the first tour, that Drachen and Vincent managed to get pretty heavily into it. I think it may have been towards the end of that first tour that I first got into pot. I also had my first acid trip. It was great, wonderful, absolutely incredible.AV: Where did that occur?AB: It occurred on the top floor of the Gorham Hotel in New York City on West 55th Street. It actually started downat an interior decorating firm in a room that theydecorated out with peacocks and trees and birds of paradise. Vincent, his wife, and I took this stuff and we were gathered around in a circle. The next thing I knew we were in this paradise and all these things around us were alive! I didn't take any more acid after that for a long time, but the amazing psychedelics we were exposed to "put paid" to two members of the band. One was in a mental home and the other was somewhat unbalanced. Drachen Theaker started kicking drums off stage during the act and would run by hotels pressing his vital parts against the windows. After all that we became unmanageable. It wasn't that there was anything wrong with it, but it wasn't manageable in terms of music. I'm not so sure that these actions were a response to the drugs as much as to the whole of American life. For example, Drachen was a very sensitive guy who came to America where there were forty-two channels of television including murders on the newscasts. Vincent had always, even early in life, had mental trouble which I didn't know then.
  • AV: Were there any positive effects from taking drugs?AB: It was positive for me in that it showed me there was a totally different way of entering life where the imagination didn't have to be something solely in dreams. For me, it urged me into various disciplines in order to reach that place rather than taking loads and loads of drugs, although I did go through periods when I did. What I ended up with, however, was more of the disciplines from Gurdjieff and Sufism.
  • AV: What was the reaction of American audiences to your shows?AB: They loved it. They not only got off on the visual end, but also in those days I still had a lot of interplay with the audience. They would be shouting things and I would be shouting back. We would have lots of laughs and things would sometimes get out of hand. The audience was also very taken with Vincent's playing. We never got audiences in England like we did in America. For example, in America, right in the middle of a solo the audience would realize what a great solo it was and start clapping. The energy would come back to us and lift the solo to a different level. In England they would, in those days, wait until the end of the number before they applauded. This feeling of connection with the audience was disturbing because we realized they were actually listening and we had to be careful of what we were saying.
  • AB: It came about when the third album with Kingdom Come was done in
  • AV: Were there plans to do a second Crazy World of Arthur Brown album?AB: Yes. We already started recording and it was to be called The Coming of the Magician. We had about an album's worth of demos, but never reached anything except "Space Plucks" and "The Teacher's Song" which later appeared on my Kingdom Come albums. I don't even know what happened to the demos, but they were quite interesting. We did some atonal pieces and also in ten time rather than four/four time.
  • AV: Vincent Crane then left the group to form Atomic Rooster which was moderately successful. What happened to him?AB: Vincent is dead. He committed suicide about three years ago in England. I don't want to discuss the details.AV: How did you feel when you heard that he died?AB: Well, Vincent's and my association had always been up and down because he was a clinical manic depressive. It was a very bitter sweet moment in that all the good and bad memories came. Suicide was a possibility which had always been on hand when I reflect upon it now, but it was a total surprise. I never thought that he would do that. felt it was somewhat of a waste because he was so talented. When I think about it now, I feel sad.
  • AV: What happened to Drachen Theaker?AB: Drachen played drums on Love's Four Sail album after he left us. He later took up tabla playing in L.A. and became the first drummer ever to appear in the Royal Festival Hall with visiting Indian musicians. He started a circuit of Indian restaurants around England, which was quite successful. He also has played with the Scottish Symphony Orchestra as a percussionist.Drachen and I also played briefly together before I started Kingdom Come. The piece we put out was by Reckless Records and it was called Strange Lands. It was released about twenty years after we recorded it. During that period he also put out some tapes from a band called Rustic Hinge which was also released in 1989 by Reckless Records. Two years ago he had an album at the top of the Italian charts from a line-up he calls Hazchem. The name is used in England as a warning for chemical hazards. He presently is selling old archive-type tapes and lives in a mansion in France.
  • AV: What did you think of Pete Townsend's cover of "Fire" which appeared on his Iron Man solo album?AB: I didn't like the fact that he changed the lyrics to make it more agreeable, but I liked the drumming.
  • AV: How did your collaboration with Klaus Schulze, the German electronic composer, come about?AB: 1974 which was actually the first band to use a drum machine instead of a drummer. It actually was an electronic band with synthesizers and a drum machine. The sound of electronic music is now very current. I think in terms of technological advances it is one of the most obvious areas for exploration musically. You also can take an instrument from anywhere in the world and use them on a keyboard. Nowhere else can you find that ability.I did three albums with Klaus Schulze. I was the vocalist on his solo Dune LP. I also did a forty city tour of Europe with him where one of the concerts was taped and used for his live LP Dymagic. I did another LP with him on a different record label called Richard Wanfried which is one of my favorite albums. I had been living in Africa and when I returned to England, there was a telegram asking me to perform with Klaus. We did a concert in Paris that he so enjoyed, he asked me to record with him.AV: Can you tell me what Schulze is like? I think his music is remarkable.AB: He has an incredible amount of energy. He's very German. Perhaps you might say a little insular. He doesn't particularly like French people or English people as an audience. He prefers a German audience. He's very much artistically in the old classical mold. He lives a life of excess, in the high romantic "composer as taster of all life is experiences" mold.AV: What do you think of the other electronic musicians such as Tangerine Dream and Do you like their music?AB: Yes, because they're exploring a particular area of electronic music. Of course, when you come to electronic music there's all those other areas such as Stockhausen, Carlos, and Cage. A lot of these new synthesizer bands that have come out of the new wave are possibly doing things that will lead in a new direction. Jarre, Vangelis, and the others all have an individual style, but all are under a particular umbrella. Now if you take someone like Peter Gabriel, you can see where his explorations are a blending of world influences without losing rhythm with current western technology.
  • AV: What recordings have you done after the Crazy World LP.AB: As I mentioned earlier, there was a Crazy World album called Strange Lands that was belatedly released by Reckless Records in 1989. It included Drachen and myself but not Vincent.After the Crazy World broke up I did three albums with Kingdom Come, some work with Alan Parsons, the Tommy movie, three albums on the Gull label, three albums with Schulze, and one other album with both Schulze and Vincent Crane. All were experimental and some were only released in Europe.I released a picture disc in 1982 called Speaknotech which was about the nuclear situation. It was originally available only by mail order. The other album is on the Republic label in Austin and the album is called Requiem. Both albums are synthesized with drum machines.
  • AV: What are your current musical endeavors?AB: We did a tour in England last year which was very successful and we were billed as The Even Crazier World of Arthur Brown. The concert we did at the Marquee Club in London was recorded and has been released as a "Live" album by Voiceprint Records (England). There are plans to tour England and Europe this coming year.There's also a concept album I'm working on with a lot of the young musicians from Austin, Texas. I'm also halfway through an opera which is more in the rock tradition although nothing like Tommy.
  • AV: One final question. Is the world of Arthur Brown still crazy after all these years?AB: It depends what crazy means.